Does “Breathe on me, breath of God” communicate God’s truth to anyone in the 21st century?
Okay I admit at the outset that I get annoyed when people have the time to listen to workshops of conferences they didn’t attend in order to find something to criticize and blog about. I’m jealous in some ways and although I don’t have the time to do that I think those who do might use their time better by engaging in real ministry.
Let us ignore at this time the cultural conservatism snobbery evident in declaring that “Slow Fade” lacks “any quality standard” (Don’t you love it when others are so right?). Lest anyone think I am merely opinionated and pugnacious (which I been known to be), I invite you to read the blog which criticized the use of “Slow Fade” (Casting Crowns) by a music pastor in a passing application. In fact that same day at the conference several hymns were used among which was one the blogger preferred.
The blogger presents his case as an either/or in choosing between “Holy, Holy, Holy” or “Slow Fade” to remind us “that maintaining a proper view of God’s holiness will cause us to put off uncleanness.” Why not both? To say “Slow Fade” doesn’t communicate God’s truth to you is one thing. To say it doesn’t communicate God’s truth to His people invites a reminder that you don’t speak for God or for His people.
"Okay I admit at the outset that I get annoyed when people have the time to listen to workshops of conferences they didn’t attend in order to find something to criticize and blog about."
Like here? https://www.urbanmissional.com/2011/02/02/youth-earth-creationism/
And here? https://www.urbanmissional.com/2010/11/10/detroit-conference/
I actually don't think you listened to these simply to find something to criticize and blog about…but then again, I doubt that's true for the link you provided either.
And, on a more serious note: Is it ever ok to say that something does not communicate God's truth to God's people?
I definitely agree with this. I occasionally read that other blog that you linked to. And the cultural snobbery that is being paraded on that blog as well as throughout much of Fundamentalism in the name of the glory of God is not only disturbing, but also a denial of 1 Peter 2:5, which says that our worship is acceptable when it is offered "through Christ," not "through 19th Century white English fine culture music."
Steve, you make some assumptions/overstatements here that you might reconsider.
1. You don't know if I do ministry all the time or never. Not sure what would qualify it as "real" or not, in your opinion, so I won't dispute whether mine is real or pretend.
2. I didn't listen to that workshop looking for something to criticize. I had found several of the mp3s from that conference helpful, and assumed I'd find that particular workshop helpful as well (and I mean helpful for something other than picking up a slack month of blogging).
3. I have lots of experience with lyrics and poetry, and I didn't say the song itself lacked any quality standard, I said that the lyrics failed to meet any quality standard other than that for pop/rock music. It is a pop/rock song, so why not take that as a complement.
4. I made no assumptions as to what was sung at Advancing the Church. I took issue with specific statements he made about traditional hymnody and what "Slow Fade" communicates.
5. Nor do I present it as an either/or choice. I state that God's truth is (somewhat latently) present in "Slow Fade". I merely suggested that it, of the four songs I quoted from, communicated truth the least fully. I think that's hard to dispute.
And in answer to your titular question, I'd say yes, and more than one. Try it in the city sometime; you might be surprised.
Steve, could some also say it's cultural snobbery to assert that the people to whom you minister are too ___ (you supply the negative adjective) to be blessed or challenged by the words of Holy, Holy, Holy or such hymns? It seems as if "tolerance" goes in only one direction these days.
Rob: Actually we use “Holy, Holy, Holy” regularly and have never used “Slow Fade” and don’t know that we would in our context (but perhaps with teens). In my opinion “Holy, Holy, Holy” communicates God’s truth to God’s people better than “Breathe on me…” and in most contexts might do it better than “Slow Fade.” My point is why should we care so much if another pastor believes he can use “Slow Fade” to communicate God’s truth.
Ben: I get annoyed with myself for doing that 🙂 Maybe I was looking for something to criticize. And I was curious about one session where I heard I was mentioned.
Sure it's okay to say that something doesn't communicate God's truth just like it's okay to differ with someone on that something but saying it doesn't make it so either way in all cases.
David,
In your original article, you said, "Let us ignore at this time that this writing itself falls short of any quality standard except that for the lyrics of pop or rock music."
Now you say, "I didn't say the song itself lacked any quality standard, I said that the lyrics failed to meet any quality standard other than that for pop/rock music. It is a pop/rock song, so why not take that as a complement."
If you really think that we were supposed to take your original comment as a complement of the song, then that's a bit insulting to our intelligence.
Thank you for taking on the cultural snobs in fundamentalism. Unfortunately, they do not exhibit humility in their deportment. They either have the attitude that they are right and everyone else is deceived or they look down upon those who do not hold their viewpoints. Let them go start their own movement of cultural and intellectual snobbery. Another reason that I would strongly consider leaving fundamentalism – cultural snobbery and the all or nothing attitude that is displayed. Again, thank you for addressing this issue.
Rick,
I stand corrected on my misspelling of compliment. :^)
I didn't really mean for that compliment thing to be taken seriously, but I think we all realize 1) the writers of "Slow Fade" were aiming for nothing higher than pop/rock standards and 2) our tradition of worship texts has often aspired to and reached higher quality standards than that.
No insult intended.
Steve,
Ultimately Radford's/Jordan's musical choices are between them and God. Radford, however, used as an example of how to implement his principal in a workshop we can assume was full of pastors and music pastors. He was seeking to influence these men. I think that's something we can respond to.
Thanks for continuing this discussion.
Glad to see I'm not the only one who gets annoyed with himself 🙂
"Sure it's okay to say that something doesn't communicate God's truth just like it's okay to differ with someone on that something but saying it doesn't make it so either way in all cases."
Agreed. It seemed that your concluding statement was really leading to a relativistic understanding of music (as long as someone is "blessed" by it it's ok, and you can't say any different).
Evaluating music is much trickier than some want to make it, and we far too easily bring our own cultural baggage and/or preferences into the mix. But I don't think that means we should not evaluate music (lyrics included). It means we need to put even more work in this area and seek to get input from thoughtful and articulate people from other cultures as well.
"They either have the attitude that they are right and everyone else is deceived or they look down upon those who do not hold their viewpoints."
Terry,
Yea, I'm glad we're so much better than those cultural snobs. I'm glad we've got the truth and they don't. I'm glad we're not arrogant or deceived like they are.
🙂